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« Game chat: Phillies settle series with Marlins today | Main | Clout offers quote of the year on Eyre/Schlitter deal »

Thursday, August 07, 2008

Comments

After winning 8 of 11 I'm guess the clubhouse isn't as we are.

This team doesn't thrive on prosperity, obviously. But I don't think they get as despondent as we do. If they did, they wouldn't be in first after they dropped back when the Mets had their hot streak.

"After winning 8 of 11 I'm guessING the clubhouse isn't as DOWN as we are."

It should say..

So you think they're content because they beat the Nats, Braves and Cardinals, but were taken at home by the second-place team? I have doubts.

The team has little energy, just treading water to stay around the top of the division. Luckily the Mets and the Marlins are just a tad worse. This team will need a Red Bull bath for the final two weeks of the season.

Mets are 2-7 vs Atl. 0-3 vs Houston. 2-5 vs SD.

Florida is 2-5 vs Cin. 3-5 vs Colorado. 5-7 vs Atl. 1-2 vs Hou.

It happens. Teams lose to lesser teams all the time. Just so happens we picked the Mets and Marlins to be the teams that beat us. We have a winning record vs every other NL team except SF (3-3).

"Not only are they starting to become tough to watch, they're uncomfortable to watch."

Truer words haven't been spoken. I used to look forward to watching the Phils every night. Now, some nights I'm perfectly content shutting it down once it becomes very clear which team has shown up.

I doubt they're content, but if they reacted to losing like BL does, they would in last place and the guys cleaning the clubhouse would be mopping up blood.

I'm not saying they're content, but they look at the bigger picture unlike those of us who live and die with each day's results.

And lumping the Cards with the Nats is a little odd-if the Cards had taken 2 of 3 from us we'd be lumping them in with the good teams.

Hey, if the Mets and Marlins beat the Braves like we do they'd be ahead of us.

Florida's 10-2 vs Washington, we're only 6-3, Mets are 5-4. If the Marlins promise not to count their Nats win if we don't, we're still ahead of them.

The thing that kills me the most is how they are just completely lifeless and situationally clueless. The bottom of the lineup is just useless and Utley, Howard and Burrell are too easy to get out with quality pitches. If I had a dollar for everytime Victorino crapped out in a key situation I could get a nice dinner.

I actually dislike this club this season. I wish I didn't feel this way, but I do. All but one season when I was a kid ('93) the Phils were pretty bad to the extent they weren't competitive. Once the new century hit, I was content with simply finishing over .500, then content with being in contention, and last year I was happy they made it to the playoffs (getting swept didn't steal my joy). However, this team just rubs me the wrong way this season, and I can't put my finger on why. Like I said, I wish I didn't feel this way. They are in 1st place after all and still stand a great chance of making the playoffs this season (in which case I consider the season a success no matter the post season outcome...those are my own standards), but I just can't allow in my head and heart for such a disgusting display of fundamental baseball to go without notation.

They really needed to Schlitter get off the pot on bullpen help, so the Eyre move made sense.

Clout with the unexpected humor, in a time when this site needs it...that's quality bro.

Yay! Clout.

I'm guessing the heat is rising in there with 9-8 Hamels getting no run support. The approach is just all wrong too many nights, not looking for something to drive, always trying to pull outside pitches, blah, blah, blah. But 6-7-8-9 are awful too often and Rollins has looked nothing like 2nd half 2005 or 2006, don't even mention 2007.

I liked them thru Sunday. Liked em last night too.

Way too many terrible seasons to put this team too high on the 'hate' list.

Anyone know the Phils magic number?

Remember when Pat Corrales was fired while the Phils were in first place? I'm sure it was done to shake up a listless club that many expected more from. That's what this team feels like. I've never seen such inconsistancy from a team. Sometimes it seems like the hitters close their eyes when the opposing pitchers let go of the ball and just swing hoping to hit it. They have talent, anyone can see that but why in hell can't they do better on a consistant basis? Should Manuel be fired? No. Despite the fact that I, like many on here think his lineups are often incorrect (Burrell should have been batting between Utley and Howard since April but only has for a couple of games), I don't think this is his fault. I don't know how I'll feel about this if they continue to play so.... aggravatingly. ARRRRGGH!

I fink they should have traded for another rightfielder. Junkins stinks! Hey, they are going for it! But I don't understand what they are going for. I can't wait to see these guys face Dodger pitching coming up. We are going to see who the good hitters are, and aren't.

Careful James L. I brought up the Corrales comparrison a month or two ago and was slammed for it. For some reason, you can't say bad things about Charlie Manuel around here. Nonetheless, I am glad I am not the only one who sees things the way that you do.

You just keep waiting for the *real* Phillies to appear.

I guess the truth is that this sagging group is the real Phillies.

I don't usually advocate firing a manger during the season. I'm not doing it now. It's not Manuel's fault the FO refuses to spend money on player development and imposes a salary cap on spending guranteeing a mediocre team. You are seeing the best you ever will get from a Philies team as long as this management team owns them. Don't get your hopes up because you are wasting your time.

I missed the end of the game; had to run to work and pick up the kid--did the postgame include "Sometimes you gotta tip your hat to the pitcher"? Come on, someone in that Phils' clubhouse can't let me down! Cholly? Anybody?

Ah, sarcasm. What Dostoyevsky said about it is so true.

East: It's just hard to picture clubhouse satisfaction after basically humiliating yourself against the Marlins, who've won three of four series now. Why would they care how the did 11 games leading up to today?

I do wonder what the posts would look like on here if the Phils were actually a bad team. I know frustrations run high and expectations higher, but the team is in 1st place right now. I've been following this team for a long time, and being in 1st right now beats the hell out of the alternative. Sometimes it is baffling why they play the way they do, and perhaps they are underachieving, but it could be much much worse. Sorry for looking at the bright side!

This was a good trade. If they get anything at all out of Eyre its easily worth it. Schlitter was a fringe guy at best who was likely never gonna help this team.

"For some reason, you can't say bad things about Charlie Manuel around here."

sarcasm? Manuel gets a lot of criticism around here.

I think the team probably recognizes their struggles. They probably know they haven't played good teams or good pitching well. I don't think they are content, but from their comments they clearly don't seem to be "pressing" or urgent. Rollins comments in the past 2 months come to mind.

Cholly is roasted here daily for his lineup choices (no Dobbs again, really?), how he handles the pitchers...not to mention we make fun of his "gut".

Again, I'm not saying they're satisfied. But I'm guessing they're not 'humiliated'. They're professionals, they make their living not taking losing 2 of 3 to a good team as the end of the world.

They're 6-8 vs Florida, many here make it sound like it's 2-12. It's not.

Why would they care how they did before the series? Because all the games count? including all the games that have us in first place ahead of the mighty Marlins, who've 'humliated' us.

Yo, new thread to complain about how much we hate our first place defending divisonal championship team that we follow every year even when they stink.

Man people here have become a bit spoiled here. "Don't like rooting for this team?" Why? It is not like this team is full of jerks and primedonnas. They even sent Eaton down to the minors.

Honestly, the only guy on the Phils that I find hard to root for right now is Myers (Admission: Personally I just don't like him).

Granted I know it is hard to watch this offense perform given its ebbs in performance this season but do people forget the turd performance of the pitching staff last year - especially the bullpen around this time.

Just for a little perspective about the "joyride of 2007" and more of a reality check:

- Phils were 59-53 at this same point last year and in 3rd places 4 games out. They had the Utley injury, a backend bullpen with luminaries such as Joe Table and El Pulpo, and a bailing wire starting rotation.

People seem to forget that the Braves had just made the Texiera trade and the Mets had begun to perk up again after a swoon in June.

- As for 2006, they were 54-57 (a staggering 12.5 games behind the Mets in 2nd place) and had written off the season by trading Abreu and Lidle. Gillick even officially said as much. Beerleaguer was not a pleasant place at that time.

It was only because Howard had one of the greatest stretches ever that this team even sniffed the playoffs that year.

It is funny. We are finally in front at this point (granted by a very now margin) and we still bitch non-stop. I am not saying this team is a juggernaut well positioned to make a deep postseason run.

They aren't BUT they certainly are capable of winning the NL East against two teams that are several flaws (Mets, Fish). Plus, I offer up this fact - what team right now would the Phils have a tough series in the playoffs? Cubs I give you but the Brewers, Cards, or Dodgers?

So let keep a lid on sanity and enjoy this "jog" in the NL East.

I will make this point though about what do piss me off:

- Since I buy tickets through Phillies.com the past few years, they send emails to my Gmail account. Fine.

In typical Phils' PR fashion, they have the stupidity to send me an email today with the headline advertising the acquisition of Eyre and to buy more tickets. Are you freaking kidding me?

Get Eyre can't hurt but worthy of an email heralding his arrival to the team. Honestly the Phils are one of the most retarded PR organizations I have seen/dealt with.

The Rays get Bradford (an actual upgrade in the pen) and the Red Sox are exploring all options including getting Giles (who would do a world of good here in RF and hitting 2nd in this lineup or 6th).

God forbid the Phils would make a move for a guy like Bradford and pick up with scary crazy contract of $3.5M next year and about a $1M this year. Ugh.

We have reached the point in the season where we need to take stock. While pitching has not been a strong point for the Phils, I agree with BAP and others who feel that the offense is the number one problem. Gillick's concept of a team laden with power hitters at the expense of OBP is deeply flawed. The story of this season is that the Phils cannot hit halfway decent pitching. What good numbers they may enjoy are largely the result of beating up on mediocre pitching. But when they face average to above average pitching, the offense gets shut down. You need look no further than their pathetic performance in the Marlins series. Because Gillick's concept in building the team is misguided, the offense tends to be highly inconsistent. I am not going to get into what personnel moves are in order next year, however,the team needs to be remade in such a way as to stress OBP. It goes without saying that the elements for this renovation must be in place, namely,an ownership willing to increase a payroll which hasn't budged for several years, better evaluation of talent (translation: not Amaro, Jr.), a manager who is not a moron, no more bottomfishing for guys like Bruntlett, and a new concept for the team. And need I add, one more good SP. Truth be known,the likelihood of any of this happening is decreased if the Phils manage to win the division. It would be better long term, if they didn't.

howards defense disgusts me.
he should be spending ALL his free time practicing throwing to 2nd and other BASIC 1st baseman duties till he stops committing errors so frequently.

MG's making sense.

Another Phillie with the unfortunate 1994 goatee.

On Manuel, it was part sarcasm and part reality. While Manuel is questioned quite a bit on here, no one is ready to part with ways with him. Sometimes I wonder how this team would play for someone else. Anyway, everyone is content since this team is in first place. Maybe I am in the minority, but if you look back over the past two months (since June 7th), the Phils record is 25-26!! Lately they have been playing better (arguably the competition has been worse), but this Florida series was another step back in my opinion. Their record against Florida, New York, Chicago, Milwaukee, and Arizona is 16-21!! Blame whoever you want. I tend to put some of that blame on the manager. Maybe the players and the front office need more blame too, but significant roster change isn't happening anytime soon. Bottom line, I am tired of seeing the same holes and the same mistakes happening time and time again (anyone think Howard will eclipse 20 errors this season?). I doubt any major change is coming with the deadline having passed. I am just glad I can discuss things/vent on here.

To the earlier point about the Phillies beating up on the bad teams, wasn't that the chink in the armor when the Phils were missing the playoffs by three games for what seemed like 10 straight years (even if it wasn't that long)? I'm not going to suddenly kill the team for not losing to the bottom feeders.

The division is going to be a battle of attrition. There will be days like this. Indeed, these days suck.

And yes, I recognize the obvious mathematical advantages of beating the second and third place teams. I'm just sayin'.

The Marlins good, young starting pitching is getting hard to ignore...

And at least the buccos come to town this weekend!!! you have to beat up on the bad teams. I'll be at that game Sat, anyone else attending a game for the weekend series?

Klaus, u r right, MG has some great points. I can remember 06 like my nightmare last night. MG is the man .

And again with Howard and the glove, I made a point last night on this and look what effin happens again. I'm not sure there are many options for subing, but he might as well have a piece of plywood on his hand cause he cant throw...or catch...

Run Up- You entirely missed the point. Beating bad pitching and bad teams is a good thing. Being unable to beat good teams and average or above average pitching is not a good thing if you are competing for the division. That has been the Phils pattern all season long. Let's not be in denial.

It wouldn't be the first time that frustration with this team has clouded my better judgment. I just have flashbacks of horror when I think about getting torn apart by Pittsburgh, Milwaukee, and the rest of the NL slop of a few years ago. I'm just happy to not be living through that particular horror this season. Yet.

Obviously, it's much better for everyone's psyche (and the division race) to beat the good teams.

At what point should Ryan Howard be considered a liability? Home runs are not everything. He strikes out at critical times and is poor at his position. Should they trade him and get some good pitching while they can? He will never be any better.

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