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Tuesday, February 15, 2011


That sounds about right. Odds are about .0003% that none of our five starters will hit the DL, so having a solid backup is beautiful. That doesn't make it easier for Kendrick, or his morale, but when you've been left off the last few postseason rosters there's really not much further to fall.

Charlie quote from David Murphy's blog:

"Sometimes people forget how hard it is to win. Sometimes they forget everything about it. I'm talking about fans, media, organizational people, players, managers, coaches. The other day I was just sitting there thinking about winning. Winning is hard. The Yankees won 27 World Series. How long have they been in existence? 128 years. That means over 100 years they lost. The Chicago Cubs haven't won a pennant in how long? 103 years? The Atlanta Braves won all those division titles and they won one World Series. Winning is tough. Winning is hard. And you've got to stay at it. When people say they are competitive, well that's what we get back to: excellence over success -- you go out and try to master your trade and you play hard every day and you play every day in the moment.

I've heard people say when they get to the World Series or a big game or a playoff game that we've got to go play in the moment. No, the moment is every day. 162 games is the moment. It's like Ted Williams said: every at-bat is an adventure. Well everytime we take the field has to be an adventure then, doesn't it? That's kind of how I look at it. . .Winning is something that you have to stay at.

Winning is team. It's we. It's us. It's playing together. But mostly, in our case, it's playing just like we always have."


Pay that man his money.

Rex...let me see if I got all of this straight.

- It is equally likely that Leyland would beat up a child than to lead the Phillies to the playoffs from 2007 - 2010.

- The front office is scared to let Charlie walk because the 2011 Phillies are straight out of Angels In The Outfield and star players will suddenly demand a trade.

- Charlie is an emperor. Those who disagree are half wits.

- you "just have this incredible desire to actually make sense."

It's brilliant analysis and well thought out opinions like these that keep me coming back to Beerleaguer.

"Here's the main problem facing management though and the real reason Charlie will 90% get extended at a pretty significant raise."

That's what's being said. I think it's bullsh*t.

The official story is that Charlie wants a raise, but the front office can't afford it for some reason (otherwise, if he's such a critical piece of the Phillies success, you just make the deal, right?).

This might have legs if they were a spendthrift team, or if the same exact scenario hadn't just played itself out with Davey Lopes.

I don't doubt that the holdup appears to be money in Charlie's eyes, but I think there is other motivation behind the front office holding their ground and not just giving in to his salary demands. You don't haggle over pennies when you're throwing around wads of cash.

They made a take-it-or-leave-it offer to Lopes with the expectation that he would leave it. I believe they're doing the same with Charlie.

Will, you're doing exactly what Rex said you were doing in the last thread: leave the straw man alone.

As far as Kyle Kendrick is concerned, IMHO, he has two million four hundred and fifty thousand reasons to suck it up and assume any role to which he is assigned.

KK has basicaly proven himself to be a reliable back of the rotation pitcher. He'll get his chance again.

awh: Saying that the front office has motivations other than money for not giving in to Charlie's contractual demands is a straw man argument?

That was my point. The first part was a summary of Rex's prior posts.

I'd rather have kept Figueroa for that role and traded Kendrick.

As UC doesn't matter, they should fire him and bring back Bowa.

One thing I love about this team...the Phour Aces have been contacted to do a variety of interviews, and they've apparently told everyone that they won't do them without Joe too. They really all seem to be great teammates.

Cholly deserves some credit for fostering that atmosphere in the clubhouse. Not every manager is willing to call out their MVP players publicly, even benching them on occasion. Every player there is accountable to him and each other. And every player honestly seems to care about being a good teammate and setting a good example.

I doubt guys like Halladay and Lee would be dying to pitch for the Phils without that environment.

Anybody see Ruiz?

"What’s next for Kendrick?"

Easy. clout's caddy.

Fire Charlie for insubordination, and bring back Lee Elia.

Carlos looks strong. I believe he prepped for the 5th slot in the order.

Just read Rosenthal's piece about the pitchers. I didn't know Oswalt was considering retirement after the season is over. . . I think if he's healthy the $16 million is a no-brainer for the Phillies.

Kendrick must feel relieved that all he needs to do this spring is work on throwing 30 perfect pitches while pretending to be stretched out for 75.

What a great quote by Charlie, thanks RM.

Repost from last thread:

I stubbed my pinkie toe!

Kyle Kendrick will prove to be valuable this year, because we all know a 6th starter will be needed. Keeping him stretched out will be the tough part if he's in the bullpen.

On Manuel- he's a great guy and has become an icon in Philly. However, with this rotation and lineup a lot of managers would make the playoffs, so Manuel isn't any miracle worker, he simply is a product of good fortune.

1) "Kyle Kendrick...has two million four hundred and fifty thousand reasons to suck it up and assume any role to which he is assigned." (I can't say it better than that.)

2) If he was so friggin good why aren't the phones ringing off the hook from other GMs.
4.75 is not that good for a starting pitcher. "Back of the rotation" means "we can't get anyone better right now." Guess what? This year we can. Maybe two people.

3) Sure he's won a bunch of games with amazing run support. What happens when he gets Hamels-level support though? (He's never won a game in which the Phils scored less than 3 runs.) With offensive numbers declining in general, it is becoming more important to be able to win those games occasionally.

4) Sorry for offending your boy, clout. I hope he has a great season, just for your sake.

Yo, new thread

"fire him and bring back Bowa."
"bring back Lee Elia"
"bring back [insert copycat joke here]"

No hyperbole here...

Yes. There are worse choices than Charlie.
It is likely that there are also better options than Charlie.

If this is about money, and Amaro has to pay Charlie a salary that makes him one of the 5 highest paid, why not shop around and see if you can get better value for that money?

To restate my point that's lost in all the "fire Charlie" jokes, I don't think this is about money. I think this is a "take-it-or-leave-it" move in which they expect he will leave it. It's the template of the Davey Lopes negotiation. No one can say for sure why they're doing this, but I find it very hard to believe that money is a factor.

I completely agree with the front office playing hardball with Charlie.

Kendrick will have his best season and will be the the surprise player of the year.

Boo Hoo for KK. Does he want to trade positions with any of us for a second? A milisecond???

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