Adding depth: Who makes sense for Phils?

Ruben Amaro Jr. indicated earlier this week the Phillies are still looking to add pitching depth.

No doubt the Phillies need arms.

After Cole Hamels and Cliff Lee, the rotation and bullpen are littered with questions marks from Miguel Gonzalez, Jonathan Pettibone and Roberto Hernandez to Jonathan Papelbon, Mike Adams and Brad Lincoln. Even steady Kyle Kendrick was a tale of two pitchers last year and in the end averaged out to be, well, Kyle Kendrick.

Two pitchers the Phillies could and should add to the mix as non-roster invitees: Ryan Madson and Chad Gaudin.

Yes, both would add even more uncertainty, but as the saying goes, if you throw enough, um, crap at the wall...

First, Madson, who hasn't pitched since the 2011 NLDS when Roy Halladay was still one of the best pitchers in the game. 

Having to sit out two straight seasons because of injury should leave the Mad Dog with no choice but to accept a spring training invite with a chance of proving himself. And so far this offseason, no team has been strongly linked to Madson except the Phillies — and a reunion between club and pitcher is supposedly a mutual interest.

No reminders are needed as to how valuable Madson was from 2007-11 with the Phils, when he posted a 2.89 ERA, 1.192 WHIP, 3.24 K/BB ratio and 49 saves. At 33, he's still young enough that a bounce-back from Tommy John surgery and his other various setbacks is possible. Worth a shot for sure.

There's also Chad Gaudin, the journeyman right-hander whose solid 2013 campaign in spacious AT&T Park hasn't convinced any club of yet to give him a guaranteed deal.

His splits do indicate he enjoyed the Giants' home grounds in 2013.

At home: 1.69 ERA, 1.146 WHIP, 2.09 K/BB ratio, 0 HR allowed
On road: 4.41 ERA, 1.347 WHIP, 2.33 K/BB ratio, 6 HR allowed 

Still, Gaudin offers depth as both a starter and reliever. In 18 appearances out of the bullpen, he posted a 2.05 ERA, 1.239 WHIP and 28 K's in 30.2 innings. He took the ball in 12 starts last season, going 5-1 with a 3.53 ERA.

The way the Phillies' current rotation is constructed, they desparetely need depth, especially after the injury to Adam Morgan, who's likely to miss most of the season. Hamels, Lee, Kendrick, Gonzalez and Hernandez is a formidable top 5, but after Pettibone as the sixth starter, who would be up next? Ethan Martin? Mario Hollands? Sean O'Sullivan? Yikes.

From 2008-12, Gaudin was mediocre but serviceable with six different teams (eight separate stints) and started 43 games over that span. Overall, he had a 4.78 ERA, 1.465 WHIP, 2.04 K/BB ratio with the A's, Cubs, Padres, Yankees, Nationals and Marlins. Who knows, maybe he could turn in one Chad Durbin-esque (2008) year for the Phils.

Comments

[smithy]

How come the Phillies didn't draft Kershaw??? Ridiculous.

Can't believe they drafted Brad Lincoln before Kershaw. What a horribly run organization.

[The Truth Injection]

Good news- A new thread

Bad news- it advocates signing Chad Gaudin.

[smithy]

"Hamels, Lee, Kendrick, Gonzalez and Hernandez is a formidable top 5,"

Formidable on getting lit up. This organization is terrible.

[CS]

Guess they have to put something out, oh wait a day old story sure.

[Cyclic]

for·mi·da·ble
adjective
1.
inspiring fear or respect through being impressively large, powerful, intense, or capable.

"Hamels, Lee, Kendrick, Gonzalez and Hernandez"

Really?

[Cyclic]

For some reason, I don't think 2008 is the Durbin-esque year we'll be getting.

[MG]

Daily refresh of the Excel spreadsheet that Rube uses with a vlookup of 'Available Players' with 'Chad' and 'Utility Infielders' is one of the main daily responsibilities of the new analytics guy right now until the start of ST.

[Meyer]

The Phillies put out feelers last fall for a pitching pick-up and Gaudin's came up near the top of the list. Maybe they can catch lightning in a bottle.

[MG]

Here is an alternative question - how many of the minor league signings/spring invites make the Opening Day roster right now?

I say 1 with it being an OF. Could be 2-3 if there are some injuries in camp.

[nokwurst]

Haven't been following too closely lately: are the Phils still insisting Ethan Martin can/should be a SP? IIRC, it's pretty much consensus from everyone other than Phils brass that he s/b a RP.

I generally say no to Gaudin, unless such a signing moves Martin to the bullpen, in which case I would then say yes.

[Phillibuster]

Durbesque has to be a real adjective, doesn't it?

[Harry Callous]

Is that guy still reporting live from the Comcast building?

[MG]

Signing Gaudin would be an upgrade over Manship. After Pettibone, it is a real crapshoot who the #6 starter is in the organization right now.

Amaro did mention the other day that Martin is stretched out if necessary to start camp as a starter and still no word on MAG besides the new pitching coach (McGlure) taking a more detailed look at him.

Basically a serious injury away to Lee/Hamels and a 60-65 win season.

[Phillibuster]

BoSox looking to trade Mike Carp could hurt Darin Ruf's trade value, since they're essentially the same player... Except Carp hits left-handed, plays LF better, and has more of a track record in the bigs (although he hits FA 3 years sooner).

[Redburb]

Basically a serious injury away to Lee/Hamels and a 60-65 win season.

Posted by: MG | Thursday, January 16, 2014 at 04:16 PM

This would be a good thing right? Amaro would take the fall.

[MG]

Redburb - It depends on your outlook. Obviously it makes this season almost unwatchable and if it an injury that required serious surgery it would effect the team beyond next season.

Right now, I don't see how this team contends this year or next. Hell, they already have a ton of money committed next year too and if JRoll is back it is $124M for just 8 guys which makes rounding out the roster even with a $160M payroll incredibly difficult.

Amaro is going to get fired at this point and sometime in the next 2 years. It is inevitable. Just a question of whether this season is bad enough and if the Phils want to eat a year of his contract which is up at the end of '15.

[socks optional]

This would be a good thing right? Amaro would take the fall.

Posted by: Redburb | Thursday, January 16, 2014 at 04:25 PM

No that would just give him another year to say "because Hamels/Lee were injured we only had 60 wins. Surely next year will be different, look we signed Yuniesky Betancourt again."

[Fatalotti]

"Hamels, Lee, Kendrick, Gonzalez and Hernandez is a formidable top 5..."

Regarding "formidable", I don't think that word means what you think it means.

Note: I know that people have already pointed that out, but whenever you get to make a Princess Bride reference, you have to jump on it.

[awh™]

"Surely next year will be different, look we signed Yuniesky Betancourt again." "

Can Betancourt pitch?

[Dickie Thong]

Phillies keep surrounding themselves with old friends

http://www.philly.com/philly/sports/phillies/Phillies_surround_themselves_with_old_friends.html

[socks optional]

Can Betancourt pitch?

Posted by: awh™ | Thursday, January 16, 2014 at 04:45 PM

He hits like a pitcher, so he's half way there.

[Harry Callous]

Dickie, good link.

I never knew Ed Wade was a mystery writer. I can go in 30 directions with that joke but I will leave it there.

[bay_area_phan]

"Signing Gaudin would be an upgrade over Manship."

Saying that Chad Gaudin is an upgrade over Jeff Manship is like having your 20-year old daughter call you on the phone to tell you that she broke up with Ted Bundy and upgraded to Aaron Hernandez.

[Harry Callous]

Bringing in Gaudin is like adding Charlie to a Senior Advisor
Triumvirate of Green, Wade and Gillick. You cannot add this, the power imbalance is too explosive.

[awh™]

"Saying that Chad Gaudin is an upgrade over Jeff Manship is like having your 20-year old daughter call you on the phone to tell you that she broke up with Ted Bundy and upgraded to Aaron Hernandez."

bap, nice.

It's also like having your 14 year-old daughter tell you that her doctor made a mistake, and your daughter isn't pregnant with triplets - she's only having twins.

[Phillibuster]

awh: Small miracles.

Youthful miracles?

[Dickie Thong]

I, for one, would like to see how many years the Chad streak can continue.

[Dickie Thong]

MLB announces expanded replay for 2014:

http://www.businessinsider.com/mlb-replay-rules-2014-1

[Unikruk]

No! No more Chads!

What is it with Ricks, anyway?

[Willard Preacher]

I'd have loved if Cholly could have stuck around just one more year to see how he'd handle the "manager challenge" aspect of instant replay. That, in and of itself, would have spiked CSN ratings.

(looking forward to an in-depth discussion on the new replay dynamic when the new post goes up sometime mid next week)

[Unikruk]

I'm shocked (and pleased!) that the replay expansion is so extensive. And tickled that baseball readily admits fielders don't have to tag second base on the force during double plays.

There's long been a tension between "hand of god"/brevity on one side and correctness/time for commercials on the other. Seems like they're starting to finally realize that their bread is buttered in TV Land rather than in the physical ballpark.

Now, if only we can get a limit of one step-out per at bat (excluding after fouls of course).

[aksmith]

I would be fine with the Phillies firing every one of the old boy network. Bowa, Wade, Green, Amaro, Charlie, Monty, Giles, etc. . . . Yes, I know the managing general partner and owners aren't going to be fired.

If all they had in the advisor position was Gillick, I'd be more than fine with that. He could represent the old school type talent evaluation. But more than that, I'd love to see an analytics guy with a GM who would actually consider, you know, analytics.

It's no fun knowing that every other organization in baseball is more advanced in talent evaluation than the Phillies.

[CS]

Kendrick 1yr/7.25

[Scott]

Chris Branch ‏@ChrisBranchTNJ 1m

Phillies announce deal with Kyle Kendrick, one-year $7.675 million to avoid arbitration.

[smithy]

Still can't believe the Phillies didn't draft Kershaw! Also - why didn't they draft Mike Trout?? Hometown hero! Was at the parade! THIS is the guy they need to draft! Ridiculous.

[The Truth Injection]

That seems slightly high for Kendrick based off last year and his performance, but it is probably not bad when compared to the deals other pitchers are getting.

[Coach Kent Murphy]

Getting closer for pitchers and catchers. And the most famous 5 words you will hear. BEST SHAPE OF MY CAREER!

[Disembodied Spirit of Corey Lidle]

I was in the best shape of my career too....oooooooooooooo

[NEPP]

That sounds exactly in line with all Arb projections for KK based on his track record.

[glanville!]

I'm just glad they only gave KK a 1-year deal

[NEPP]

The funny thing is that when I mentioned the Brad Lincoln draft in the previous thread I thought it was a given that everyone knew we werent the team that drafted him...guess I was wrong.

[NEPP]

http://www.csnphilly.com/baseball-philadelphia-phillies/maikel-franco-will-see-time-first-base-2014

Basically the gist of this Seidman article is that they're moving Franco to 1B this year but they "still see him as a 3B".

Yeah, sure they do...that's why they're moving him to the far easier defensive position.

[Cyclic]

"Franco says he has been told by the Phillies that he'll play primarily first base this season, though he'll still see time at third."

"It's not the case, he's not gonna be primarily first base," Amaro said. "He's a third baseman, he may get some work at first base, but he's primarily a third baseman."

LMFAO this organization

[cut_fastball]

I wonder if 2016 actually brings "Dodger Dollars" to your Philadelphia Phillies? Or if the god-forsaken "limited" partnership laundries every dime over the luxury threshold?

[aksmith]

NEPP - Yeah, everyone realized the Phillies did not draft Lincoln. They were not drafting high enough to get either Lincoln or Kershaw.

"Smithy" is just Captain Hindsight being what he's been all along, Captain Hind End.

[The Truth Injection]

NEPP: I bet they could've gotten Kendrick 3 million. I don't need to prove that.

[Kashmir]

According to the article Hamels, Lee, Kendrick, Gonzalez and Hernandez is a formidable top 5. Hamels and Lee are definitely one of the better one-two's. Unless Gonzalez becomes the pitcher we were told when he first agreed to a 50 million dollar contract and doesn't become the pitcher Amaro now talks about contending for the 5th job, then it's formidable. If Gonzalez is a 5th or 6th starter this rotation is far from formidable.

[Chris in VT]

If MAG can actually be a #3, this rotation is above average...but according to the Phils MAG is closer to a 5/6, and IMO Hernandez will be out of the rotation by July.